Kyle Roof Talks EEAT and the FUTURE of SEO with Artificial Intelligence

Last updated: Jun 15, 2023

This video by SirLinksalot is an interview with Kyle Roof, an SEO expert, discussing his victory in a Google ranking contest using lorem ipsum content and how he used artificial intelligence to inform his decisions on where to insert keywords in the article.

The video is an interview with Kyle Roof, a well-known figure in the SEO industry.

The interviewer asks Kyle about his famous victory in a Google ranking contest using Lorem Ipsum content, which he won by using math-based techniques to insert keywords in specific places on the page.

Kyle also discusses his thoughts on the future of SEO and how artificial intelligence may play a role in it. He talks about his SEO agency, High Voltage SEO, and his popular SEO tool, Page Optimizer Pro.

The interview touches on Kyle's family life and how he balances his work and personal life.

  • Kyle Roof is an SEO expert and co-founder of High Voltage SEO, a popular SEO agency.
  • He is known for winning a Google ranking contest using lorem ipsum content.
  • Good copy is essential for conversion, but ranking is math-based.
  • Kyle Roof believes that artificial intelligence will play a significant role in the future of SEO.
  • LSI keywords and BM25 are important ranking factors.
  • Some people use hidden text for contextual terms and variations.
  • Several sites are still ranking in the number one spot for their terms using lorem ipsum pages.
  • Branded Web 2.0s can be used as a link diversity tool or at the beginning of the ranking process.
  • Kyle Roof used AI to inform his decisions on where to insert keywords in the article.
  • It's possible to create a tool without dev experience by hiring developers and having a clear understanding of the problem and data.

Kyle Roof Talks EEAT and the FUTURE of SEO with Artificial Intelligence - YouTube

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Kyle Roof's Background and Achievements

  • Kyle Roof is an SEO expert and co-founder of High Voltage SEO, a popular SEO agency.
  • He is also the co-creator of Page Optimizer Pro, an SEO tool, and co-founder of Internet Marketing Gold, an SEO community with over 3000 members.
  • Kyle Roof is known for winning a Google ranking contest using lorem ipsum content, which is essentially gibberish Latin placeholder content.
  • He has spoken at various SEO conferences and done numerous podcasts.
  • Kyle Roof is a family man who loves and supports his family.
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Kyle Roof's Lorem Ipsum Victory

  • Kyle Roof and his team entered a 30-day Google ranking competition for the term "rhinoplasty Plano."
  • They used lorem ipsum content and did not touch the site for two weeks.
  • After two weeks, they went from page nine to page one, and after a few more weeks, they were number one in organic and maps.
  • Kyle Roof used artificial intelligence to inform his decisions on where to insert keywords in the article.
  • He used a tool to determine the keyword counts and variations needed in specific places on the page.
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The Importance of Good Copy and Math-Based Ranking

  • Kyle Roof's victory showed that good copy is essential for conversion, but ranking is math-based.
  • Google looks for specific terms in specific places on the page.
  • If you can satisfy the math, you can rank very well.
  • Kyle Roof used artificial intelligence to determine the keyword counts and variations needed in specific places on the page.
  • He put those counts in other places such as headings, paragraph text, and anchor links.
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Kyle Roof Talks EEAT and the FUTURE of SEO with Artificial Intelligence - YouTube

The Future of SEO with Artificial Intelligence

  • Kyle Roof believes that artificial intelligence will play a significant role in the future of SEO.
  • AI can help with keyword research, content creation, and link building.
  • AI can also help with analyzing data and making informed decisions.
  • However, AI cannot replace human creativity and intuition.
  • SEO experts still need to use their expertise and experience to make the best decisions.
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LSI Keywords and BM25

  • LSI keywords are close synonyms or constructions of target terms.
  • LSI terms provide context and meaning.
  • BM25 is a ranking factor that is a close approximation of what Google uses.
  • BM25 is a bag of words model that counts words in specific places.
  • Yandex results and Google results are about 70% the same.
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Using Hidden Text for Contextual Terms

  • Some people use chunks of contextual terms and variations in hidden text.
  • These chunks of hidden text can be a whole block of contextual terms.
  • People who use hidden text for contextual terms and variations do quite well.
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Ranking with Lorem Ipsum

  • Several sites are still ranking in the number one spot for their terms using lorem ipsum pages.
  • Good copy should hit the counts and satisfy the counts pretty well.
  • A lot of people are terrible at writing and miss the topic completely.
  • LSI terms fit perfectly in the bag of words model used by Google.
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The Future of SEO with Artificial Intelligence

  • AI content is rising, and some people are saying lorem ipsum can still rank in 2023.
  • Using AI to inform decisions on where to insert keywords in an article can be effective.
  • AI can help with content creation and optimization.
  • AI can help with link building and outreach.
  • AI can help with data analysis and reporting.
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Good Copy vs SEO Copy

  • The intersection of good copy and SEO copy is when someone can't write good copy or doesn't care about the topic.
  • A proper outline can help in writing good copy and SEO copy.
  • Writing online is boring and takes a lot of time.
  • Asking for an outline can give a good jump start.
  • Writing an entire article based on the outline can give a good account of any tool.
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Using Branded Web 2.0s

  • Branded Web 2.0s can be used as a link diversity tool or at the beginning of the ranking process.
  • It's important to own the brand name across the web to prevent competitors from taking it.
  • Web 2.0s can be treated like citations that you completely control.
  • They can act as a branding tool and are more natural than creating mini sites.
  • Testing it out with a little less can save time and budget.
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Using AI for SEO

  • Kyle Roof used AI to inform his decisions on where to insert keywords in the article.
  • AI can help in brainstorming or planning type tool.
  • AI is better at that kind of stuff than actually writing content of any kind of length.
  • AI can be used to analyze competitors' content and find gaps in their content.
  • AI can help in finding the right keywords to target.
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Creating a Tool without Dev Experience

  • Kyle Roof didn't have any dev experience when he started creating the tool that helped him win the competition.
  • Hiring developers to code some things can be helpful.
  • It's important to have a clear idea of what you want the tool to do.
  • It's important to have a good understanding of the problem you're trying to solve.
  • It's important to have a good understanding of the data you're working with.
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Monitoring Work and Finding Developers

  • Look at the output to determine if it is what you want, even if the process is not perfect.
  • Having two developers working at the same time can help with quality control.
  • Developers with experience in both Python and JavaScript are highly valuable.
  • Finding good developers can be a challenge, and many may overestimate their abilities.
  • One strategy is to have a strong developer mentor and train a newer developer.
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The Difficulty of Building a Page Optimizer Prototype Tool

  • Building a page optimizer prototype tool is a complex task that requires a lot of skill.
  • It is important to be prepared to invest a lot of time and effort into the project.
  • There are many tools available that are easier to use and can still be effective.
  • Starting with a smaller project can be a good way to gain experience and build skills.
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The Importance of Inspecting What You Expect

  • It is important to inspect the work being done to ensure it meets your expectations.
  • Developers should be able to explain their code and notation to others.
  • Having two developers check each other's work can help catch errors and improve quality.
  • Developers with experience in both front-end and back-end development are highly valuable.
  • Finding good developers can be a challenge, and it may take time to find the right fit.
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The Challenge of Finding Skilled Developers

  • Many developers overestimate their abilities and may not be able to handle complex projects.
  • It can be helpful to have a strong developer mentor and train a newer developer.
  • Developers with experience in both Python and JavaScript are highly valuable.
  • Building a page optimizer prototype tool is a complex task that requires a lot of skill.
  • It may take time and effort to find the right developer for a project.
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Background of the Project

  • The project started in 2017.
  • The team was using another tool internally in the agency.
  • The tool had a feature that they really liked and were getting a lot of success with it in terms of optimization score.
  • The feature was removed when the toolbox was updated.
  • They tried to roll back or buy a version of the old tool, but it was not possible.
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Flexibility of the Tool

  • People use the tool in a way that the creators did not imagine.
  • Some people use some of the features as the main tool in their SEO.
  • When making major updates, they try to keep all the Legacy stuff around somewhere so that people can still continue to use it.
  • It is a challenge to make changes or updates to the process without putting a burden on the users.
  • They try to be mindful of how people are using the tool and how they integrate it into their systems.
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SEO Testing Patent

  • Kyle Roof has both a Google Rule and an SEO patent.
  • The SEO patent was more of a marketing concept.
  • An attorney is needed to write things up appropriately for the patent.
  • The patent costs around four to five thousand dollars to do the whole thing.
  • The patent is on a very basic testing model of creating multiple identical pages and then tweaking one thing on one of them and then gauging the response from there.
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Conclusion

  • The project started in 2017 and had a feature that was removed when the toolbox was updated.
  • The tool is flexible and people use it in a way that the creators did not imagine.
  • Kyle Roof has both a Google Rule and an SEO patent.
  • The patent is on a very basic testing model of creating multiple identical pages and then tweaking one thing on one of them and then gauging the response from there.
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AI Testing

  • Kyle Roof discusses his recent testing with AI.
  • He asked the AI about current events and found that it only knew information up until February 2021.
  • The AI confidently gave wrong answers to some questions, highlighting the inherent problems with AI as a single answer search engine.
  • Single answer type things will only be useful for featured snippet type features rather than an actual search engine.
  • Voice search has turned into asking simple questions like what time it is or what the weather is like.
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EEAT

  • Kyle Roof discusses his thoughts on Google's hostility towards affiliate sites.
  • He realized that affiliate sites were running afoul of Google's principles by trying to hide who was responsible for the website and content.
  • Within pop, they built a tool to measure things going through the quality radar guidelines and pick out things that a bot can find.
  • EEAT stands for Expertise, Authoritativeness, Trustworthiness, and it's what Google is looking for in a website.
  • EEAT is important for affiliate sites to establish themselves as a real business and show that they have expertise, authoritativeness, and trustworthiness.
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Future of SEO

  • Kyle Roof discusses the future of SEO with AI.
  • AI will be useful for single answer type things like featured snippets.
  • AI will not replace traditional SEO, but it will be a tool to help with keyword research and content optimization.
  • AI will be able to analyze user behavior and provide insights into what users are looking for.
  • AI will be able to help with content creation by analyzing what content is performing well and providing suggestions for improvement.
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Conclusion

  • Kyle Roof believes that AI will be a useful tool for SEO, but it will not replace traditional SEO.
  • EEAT is important for affiliate sites to establish themselves as a real business and show that they have expertise, authoritativeness, and trustworthiness.
  • AI will be able to provide insights into user behavior and help with content creation and optimization.
  • The future of SEO with AI is exciting, but it's important to remember that AI is not a replacement for human expertise and creativity.
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Trustworthiness and the Importance of Legitimacy

  • Google looks for particular signals to determine if a site should be in the index in the first place.
  • Having success in maintaining and recovering rankings by putting in those signals.
  • Affiliates hate taking the bare minimum steps to show they are a legitimate business.
  • Many people don't comprehend that if they're taking money through their website, that's a business.
  • Establishing an actual business can significantly increase the cost of startup for the average affiliate.
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Getting a Business Mailing Address

  • Two options for getting a business mailing address: a registered agent or a business mailing address.
  • Businesses that don't have walk-in visitors might use a different address for mailing.
  • Put the address in the organization schema and within the content of the site.
  • Having a business mailing address is a huge step forward for most sites.
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The Importance of Trustworthiness in SEO

  • Trust is in the middle of the revamped rated guidelines.
  • Who is responsible for the website and the content are the two main things.
  • It is imperative to tick off as many boxes as possible in the trust factor before worrying about expertise or authoritativeness.
  • The T and EAT are all the things that a normal online business would do to show that they are legitimate.
  • Step number one is to know where the business is located.
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The Importance of Clear Authorship

  • Who is writing the content is a huge point in the quality rate of guidelines.
  • Make it clear if there is a staff writer or if the website is responsible for the content.
  • Put the author's name within the author schema of the article.
  • If someone follows the advice and is harmed, they need to know who is responsible.
  • If someone follows the advice and it's incorrect, they need to know how to get it corrected.
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Section 1: Importance of T (Trustworthiness)

  • Questions related to T are important and can lead to problems if the information is incorrect.
  • Google may not index a site if nobody is taking responsibility for the content or the website.
  • Important T boxes to tick include terms of service, privacy policy, and contact information.
  • Companies should have different email addresses for different departments on their site.
  • Quality reader guidelines are not a ranking factor but are checked by bots at some point.
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Section 2: Importance of A (Authoritativeness)

  • A go-to source for a topic is considered authoritative.
  • Topical authority is important for A.
  • An authoritative source answers all questions related to a topic.
  • An authoritative source has more than one page on a topic.
  • Authoritativeness is not a ranking factor but is checked by bots at some point.
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Section 3: Importance of E (Expertise)

  • Expertise is important for E.
  • Expertise is demonstrated through credentials, experience, and knowledge.
  • Expertise is not a ranking factor but is checked by bots at some point.
  • Expertise is important for YMYL (Your Money or Your Life) sites.
  • Expertise is important for sites that provide medical, financial, or legal advice.
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Section 4: Importance of T, A, and E for SEO

  • T, A, and E are important for SEO.
  • Google's algorithm is designed to produce trustworthy, authoritative, and expert content.
  • SEO experts should focus on creating content that meets T, A, and E criteria.
  • AI tools can help SEO experts analyze and optimize content for T, A, and E.
  • SEO experts should stay up-to-date with Google's guidelines and algorithm updates.
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Authoritativeness and Topical Coverage

  • Topical coverage is an important factor in demonstrating authoritativeness.
  • User-generated content (UGC) is also a strong signal of authoritativeness.
  • Turning on blog comments and moderating them can help demonstrate authoritativeness.
  • Comments should be readable by Google.
  • Backlinks are a different part of the algorithm and should be focused on for a different type of authoritativeness.
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Do All the Things: Topical Authority vs. Backlink Authority

  • Topical authority has become a hot topic in SEO.
  • Doing both topical and backlink authority is recommended.
  • Investing time and energy in your own website is important.
  • Ranking can be done without any backlinks through topical coverage.
  • Going after zero search volume SERPs can be effective.
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The Future of SEO with Artificial Intelligence

  • Artificial intelligence can inform decisions on where to insert keywords in an article.
  • AI can also help with content creation and optimization.
  • AI can analyze user behavior and preferences to improve website design and user experience.
  • AI can help with link building by identifying high-quality websites to target.
  • AI can assist with data analysis and reporting to improve SEO strategies.
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The Importance of Testing and Experimentation

  • Testing and experimentation are crucial in SEO.
  • Testing can help identify what works and what doesn't.
  • Experimentation can lead to new and innovative strategies.
  • Testing and experimentation should be ongoing and iterative.
  • Results should be tracked and analyzed to inform future strategies.
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Ranking for More Keywords

  • Foundationally, part of SEO campaigns is to rank for more keywords.
  • Winning terms that hit page one quickly and gaining those terms can help.
  • Little pages that rank quickly juice up and bring in impressions.
  • Linking from those pages to target pages can make them perform better.
  • Researching terms that can be won quickly and taking advantage of the authority built by ranking for those terms can help.
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Backlink Authority

  • Two websites with the exact same topical coverage would be differentiated by backlink authority.
  • On-page optimization can only take a page so far in ranking for a particular keyword.
  • Building out supporting pages and linking them together can help push a page further.
  • After that, backlinks are needed to go further.
  • Content plans should start with the main targets and build up smaller SERP targeting type content to build up to the main position.
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EEAT and the New E

  • The new E in EEAT stands for experience.
  • Expertise is education, while experience is actual experience with something or time spent doing something.
  • Google values a real person doing the work on a website.
  • An author bio page with links to social profiles and credentialing agencies can demonstrate a real person doing the work.
  • Articles should have schema and author schema linking back to the author bio page.
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Conclusion

  • Ranking for more keywords is important in SEO campaigns.
  • Backlink authority is necessary to differentiate websites with the same topical coverage.
  • On-page optimization can only take a page so far, and supporting pages and backlinks are needed to go further.
  • EEAT values a real person doing the work on a website.
  • An author bio page with links to social profiles and credentialing agencies can demonstrate a real person doing the work.
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Creating a Fake Persona for SEO

  • Creating a fake photo is easily detected as fake by Google.
  • Build branded Web 2.0 profiles for the fake persona.
  • Create profiles on Google Books and other scholarly type places.
  • Fill out the about section and make a post on social profiles.
  • Google will not be going to LinkedIn profile or other social profiles.
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Manual Penalty and Quality Control

  • Manual penalty is a boogeyman and it's all algorithmic at this point.
  • The internet is too large for manual penalty for all keywords in all niches.
  • Manual penalty is rare and getting struck by lightning kind of bad luck.
  • Trust is the most important part of EAT and you have to hit it in the middle.
  • Pop will help you cover what your competitors are doing in regards to EAT.
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Section 1: EAT Signals

  • The tool will pull out the EAT signals on your page and your competitor's pages.
  • It will let you know how many EAT signals you have and how many your competitors have.
  • You can see if your competitors have something that you don't have and add it to your page.
  • It's not going to push up rank, but it will help Google get past your site.
  • You can do a double check to see if your competitors are doing something you haven't thought of and add it to your page.
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Section 2: AI and SEO

  • SEO is not dead as long as there is an algorithm.
  • AI is not going to kill the internet or change SEO.
  • The release of BERT had a featured snippet type answer with no link attribution.
  • It's just pure thievery and taking content from someone else and claiming it as their own.
  • It's not creating anything new, it's just spinning the information it has.
  • It will be detected as duplicate content and discounted by Google.
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Section 3: AI and Content Creation

  • AI is not creating anything new, it's just spinning existing information.
  • It's not inspired, it's being taught how to steal.
  • It's imminent problematic to have a featured snippet with no source because it simply took from somewhere.
  • It's not going to replace human content creation.
  • AI can be used to assist in content creation, but it's not a replacement for human creativity.
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Section 4: Future of SEO

  • SEO will continue to evolve, but it's not going to die.
  • AI will continue to play a role in SEO, but it's not going to replace human creativity.
  • SEO experts need to stay up to date with the latest trends and technologies.
  • SEO is about understanding the user's intent and providing the best possible experience.
  • SEO is about creating high-quality content that meets the user's needs.
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AI and SEO

  • AI won't be the end of the world for SEO as long as there's an algorithm.
  • Opting out in mass is possible with a "no snippet" tag.
  • Bing could take more market share if Google steals from everybody.
  • AI is not as simple as people think in terms of the answers it provides and attribution.
  • AI is being used for content planning and early rough drafts.
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Using AI for Outlines and Content

  • AI is used for outlines and early rough drafts to get an idea of where to take an article.
  • It's mostly used for lower-level supporting content that doesn't need to be the nicest written content of all time.
  • Human editing is necessary to make the content unique and to get past AI/duplicate content filters.
  • AI is essentially a fancy content spinner.
  • It simplifies the process of content creation, but it's not as complex as people think.
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AI and Job Losses

  • AI won't be a job killer for SEO.
  • AI will enhance search and what can be done, but it won't replace human jobs.
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Google and AI Content

  • It's unclear if Google is currently penalizing AI content.
  • The conversation has moved past whether Google cares about AI to whether it's penalizing it.
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Google's view on AI and duplicate content

  • Google values content that adds to the conversation, not just regurgitates existing information.
  • Duplicate content is penalized because it doesn't add anything new to the conversation.
  • The Helpful content update targets large sites generated purely by AI because they are spam and don't add anything to the conversation.
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Filter for penalizing AI-generated content

  • Content generated purely by AI will be treated the same way as duplicate content and will be devalued.
  • Google will penalize sites that add content that says nothing different and is all the exact same stuff.
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Using AI for idea generation

  • AI can be used for idea generation by asking what should be on a page or what should be covered.
  • SEO minion can be used to get layers of people also ask questions or chat can be used for faster results.
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Google's double standard on content

  • Google is adding chat GBT to the top of the SERP, which will take over the featured snippet area and lower click-through rates.
  • Google can steal content, but other sites cannot use the same type of content without getting penalized.
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User experience signals and ranking factors

  • User experience signals are hard to measure, so they are not a major concern for ranking factors.
  • Google is unlikely to penalize sites for providing a good user experience, even if users leave the site after finding the information they need.
  • The most important ranking factors moving forward are likely to be those that provide the best user experience and add value to the conversation.
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Top Ranking Factors for 2023

  • The top four places to put a keyword have been the same since 2015: domains, URL, title, and H1.
  • It's important to get the keyword in the paragraph text at least once.
  • Page builders sometimes use div tags instead of proper paragraph tags, which can hurt your ranking.
  • Heading tags should also be used properly.
  • Google will eventually find content in div tags, but it may take longer and devalue the content.
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Relaxation Activities

  • Kyle enjoys watching BBC crime dramas and crime comedies.
  • He also likes the Acorn and BritBox channels on Amazon Prime.
  • He recently watched the movie Knives Out, which he enjoyed.
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Why Chiang Mai is the Place to Be for SEO

  • The community in Chiang Mai is second to none for learning and growing in SEO.
  • There is an abundance mentality where everyone wants to help each other succeed.
  • Weekly meetups and quarterly masterminds are held to help people learn and grow together.
  • They are organizing an event to teach people how to do an SEO audit and provide audits to local businesses for $50, with the proceeds going to a local charity.
  • Chiang Mai is a great place to level up your game and improve your opportunities in SEO.
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Kyle Roof Talks EEAT and the FUTURE of SEO with Artificial Intelligence

  • Kyle Roof won a Google ranking contest using lorem ipsum content.
  • He used artificial intelligence to inform his decisions on where to insert keywords in the article.
  • EEAT (Expertise, Authoritativeness, Trustworthiness) is becoming increasingly important in SEO.
  • Google is using AI to better understand the content on a website and rank it accordingly.
  • Roof recommends using AI tools to analyze and optimize content for EEAT and other SEO factors.
  • He also suggests focusing on user experience and creating high-quality, valuable content.

Watch the video on YouTube:
Kyle Roof Talks EEAT and the FUTURE of SEO with Artificial Intelligence - YouTube